This forum is dedicated to discussions on how to grow the sport of hang gliding. We will take a methodical approach to collect data and come up with implementable ideas on how to increase our numbers. This includes effective marketing, lead generation, site access issues, improving regulations, lack of instructors, lack of sites, etc

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By AIRTHUG
#201468
peanuts wrote:wanna know how to propagate hang gliding? fly a hang glider.
BUY a hang glider (a NEW one!)... that supports the manufacturers that we know and love... they're the ones on the front line revolutionizing equipment and making things easier and safer than ever.

And it supports the people that are out there teaching the sport to new students. I can attest to how much it costs to run a school/business... This is season 3 and still no where near profitable... but this season I've been sustaining, due mostly to the local flying community buying locally and supporting their local dealer (after all, if they have a good dealer, it's in their best interest to keep them around too!)
User avatar
By selbaer
#201470
flyhigh013 wrote:
peanuts wrote:wanna know how to propagate hang gliding? fly a hang glider.
BUY a hang glider (a NEW one!)...
If you buy a used one you might be able to put the cash needed to buy a new one in some pilots hand.
Image
User avatar
By Anadactyl
#201495
selbaer wrote:
flyhigh013 wrote:
peanuts wrote:wanna know how to propagate hang gliding? fly a hang glider.
BUY a hang glider (a NEW one!)...
If you buy a used one you might be able to put the cash needed to buy a new one in some pilots hand.
Image
Excellent point. If no one bought used gliders many people wouldn't be able to fly and the more experienced pilots might not be able to trade up and get new wings. The economics of buying used equipment are complicated, but it usually works out for the best.
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By foamkiller
#211541
what abought making it ataneable goal for those how are all ready interested :crazy:
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By blindrodie
#211543
Looks like a F 1 140. Is it?
User avatar
By foamkiller
#211547
free tandoms /cheeper traning/ instructors willing to give u ratings and not just line there pockets / mabe i am old school but has everbody forgot our roots :crazy:
By blindrodie
#211549
Sounds like how I started. No money lined pockets in Kansas! We fly for the love of the sport... 8) Nice little 170.
User avatar
By foamkiller
#211553
:mrgreen: this & a trike needs no h rating
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User avatar
By BBJCaptain
#211578
foamkiller wrote:free tandoms /cheeper traning/ instructors willing to give u ratings and not just line there pockets / mabe i am old school but has everbody forgot our roots :crazy:
Foamkiller

:welcome:

I will probably suffer the wrath of several people here but frankly I could care less.

If you read FAR 103 you will not find any part that tells you that you have to have a
license, rating, annual review, biannual review, be a member of any org. or pay any
dues to any org. to fly. You simply have to conduct your flight in accordance with the
guidelines set forth in Part 103.

The last time I looked ( but that has been going the wrong way lately) this is still a
free country. Never let anyone tell you that you can't fly. Just stay safe!!! It
sounds like you have a group of pilots that you fly with and I am sure you trust
their judgement. Stay within your comfort level and never ignore the hair on the
back of your neck. I have been HG off and on for over 30+ years and I have
never had even 1 formal lesson from and instructor. I am not saying this is for
everyone, but I learned by example and discussion not from my wallet and my gas tank.

Fly you ass off my friend :thumbsup:

With the improved safety of todays equipment, getting back to the best parts of
our roots would be a great thing for the future of HG!!

Sadly this is the very reason HG is dying a slow death from frustration and disgust.
User avatar
By foamkiller
#211594
amen glad there outher 's out there :lol:
User avatar
By mattboy
#257680
BBJCaptain wrote: I will probably suffer the wrath of several people here but frankly I could care less.

If you read FAR 103 you will not find any part that tells you that you have to have a
license, rating, annual review, biannual review, be a member of any org. or pay any
dues to any org. to fly. You simply have to conduct your flight in accordance with the
guidelines set forth in Part 103.
.
True, but how many sites (or LZs) would be available today without that organization (especially in a litigation happy country like the U.S.). I don't agree with everything that goes on with the USHPA, but you've got to see the benefit there.

One way that would be great to "spread you wings" is if there were more training hills close to urban areas. We could all use more practice on those and if they were convenient to get to AND visible to the public, I think we'd see more interest (not to mention better skills). All you'd need is a large park/field and some dirt!

Instructors would have a convenient place to train students at as well!
#257694
Wingspan34 wrote:
Large open public park fields, or (at time of landing) inactive athletic fields are what I'm thinking about. Either way, places where some number of people could be encountered (but not hit, coming in to land).

Imagine the impact of putting a REAL LIVE Hang Glider AND it's Pilot, right in front of the public! And I'm not talking about just one glider landing in some High School soccer field. I'm talking about 1, then 2, then 3 or more gliders all coming in to land, one after the other, at the same public site. (always with safety in mind, thank you!)

What if the local paper, or even TV station was alerted to such an event as, or better yet - before, it took place?
I'm about as new to hang gliding as they come. Did my first 5 launches off of bunny hills and an aerotow / tandem to 4000' last Friday.

But being involved in skydiving for 5 and half years I feel I might have a little to contribute here.

Every year I'm involved with 8 to 10 skydiving demos for the general public. Most of these are done into the 18th fairway in front of the club house at golf courses. Every now and then we will fly the game ball in at a homecoming football game for a high school and we do demos at 2 different public sports complex as well. One of those is for a meet your public servants day - police officers, EMTs, firemen, nurses, etc... the other is on 4th of July followed by a fireworks show paid for by the city it's in.

Most of these demos are done on holidays or holiday weekends. Memorial Day, Labor Day, Veteran's Day, and 4th of July which is our busiest with 5 demos for that weekend alone for the last 3 years in a row.

There are waivers that can be filed with the FAA that will allow you to not have to abide by the everyday rules for flights for these special occasions.

Ground crews and radio communications with the drop plane are required up until the moment the skydivers exit the plane. Then it's up to the ground crew to keep the public out of the landing area and the wind direction clearly marked for landing. And normally there is plenty of local TV reporters and cameras around to record the event as well.

Now take that info and apply it to hang gliders. Aerotows could be a way to do it. You just need a small airfield near the demo. You would be surprised how may small public airports are out there. All of our waivers are filed 30 days prior to the event, and then a notam is filed 24 to 48 hours in advance of the demo. And depending on the classification of the airspace over the demo sometimes we are required to contact a control tower somewhere an hour before and an hour after the demo.

This could really be something worth looking into. The general public is normally in awe of anything in the air and the kids go crazy wanting autographs from everyone involved, skydivers and ground crew alike. I imagine their enthusiasm would be the same whether it is a skydiver under canopy or a hang glider pilot under a kite. I also suspect that a hang glider demo could last a little longer than a skydiving one.

I would be willing to help with ground crew duties anywhere in GA, TN, AL, and MS.
User avatar
By Paul H
#257699
Except for tandem flying.

BBJCaptain wrote:

:welcome:

I will probably suffer the wrath of several people here but frankly I could care less.

If you read FAR 103 you will not find any part that tells you that you have to have a
license, rating, annual review, biannual review, be a member of any org. or pay any
dues to any org. to fly. You simply have to conduct your flight in accordance with the
guidelines set forth in Part 103.

The last time I looked ( but that has been going the wrong way lately) this is still a
free country. Never let anyone tell you that you can't fly. Just stay safe!!! It
sounds like you have a group of pilots that you fly with and I am sure you trust
their judgement. Stay within your comfort level and never ignore the hair on the
back of your neck. I have been HG off and on for over 30+ years and I have
never had even 1 formal lesson from and instructor. I am not saying this is for
everyone, but I learned by example and discussion not from my wallet and my gas tank.

Fly you ass off my friend :thumbsup:

With the improved safety of todays equipment, getting back to the best parts of
our roots would be a great thing for the future of HG!!

Sadly this is the very reason HG is dying a slow death from frustration and disgust.
User avatar
By foamkiller
#257746
well i am still h1.9 and have flown my falcon 106 times still no broken down tubes a magic iv a fledge IIb , a old standerd & my airwave formula 154 on a
trike for 20 hours ! I will remain a ushpa member just to be a p.i.t.a.

h 1 for ever with a F.U. endorsment ( regon 9 sucks)

Rich . H master rating got with a case of beer !
what a deal
:mosh:
User avatar
By Windlord
#257777
"For the love of the sport" yep, that's where we came from.
If the instructor could make a sale of equipment, then that was a plus, but not a priority.
Wing, harness and helmet set me back $550, at that time, and well worth it. Of course the wife didn't like it. :mrgreen:
User avatar
By ChattaroyMan
#257796
My $.02 ..... more flying sites where non-pilots can watch flying being conducted is the key to more people entering the sport. Out of sight - out of mind.

Or.... GoPros that stream HD video live to the Web - where anyone can watch from anywhere @ any time. Dreaming on......
:popcorn:
User avatar
By Dontsink
#267937
I,ve been an airline pilot for 15 years.Recently i started looking for the simplest,most pure way to fly.HG seems to fit the bill...but does it really?.
The weight and bulk of the HG gear are the reason i'm taking a PG course( don't shoot me please!).
Compared to HG a PG is not very exciting at all,it floats rather than flies...but the setup i'm going to get for PG is below 10 kg ALL included and fits in a backpack.So i can hike a beatiful mountain and fly,and that is exciting for me.
Why am i posting this?, so you'd know my personal reasons for choosing a balloon-like,collapsable,slow PG over a sexy HG.
I think my reasons apply to lots of people that are shying away from HG into the perverse folds of PG.When i researched HG i was very surprised to find that beginner- intermediate gear was still Alu,steel wires and dacron.That's so eighties,no wonder they are heavy!.
Maybe ( probably) i'm an ignorant just for asking this but...wouldn't a high- tech materials simple wing save a lot of weight?.Is there an engineering reason( other than cost) that makes it undoable?.
If they ever make a hikable HG i'll jump into the sport,meanwhile i'll float-collapse around the sky in my PG.I will probably take an HG course just to try it but i cant't see myself really getting into the sport.Who knows...
Just my two cents,don't nobody get offended eh!.
User avatar
By Dan Harding
#267939
Dontsink wrote:I,ve been an airline pilot for 15 years.Recently i started looking for the simplest,most pure way to fly.HG seems to fit the bill...but does it really?.
The weight and bulk of the HG gear are the reason i'm taking a PG course( don't shoot me please!).
Compared to HG a PG is not very exciting at all,it floats rather than flies...but the setup i'm going to get for PG is below 10 kg ALL included and fits in a backpack.So i can hike a beatiful mountain and fly,and that is exciting for me.
Why am i posting this?, so you'd know my personal reasons for choosing a balloon-like,collapsable,slow PG over a sexy HG.
I think my reasons apply to lots of people that are shying away from HG into the perverse folds of PG.When i researched HG i was very surprised to find that beginner- intermediate gear was still Alu,steel wires and dacron.That's so eighties,no wonder they are heavy!.
Maybe ( probably) i'm an ignorant just for asking this but...wouldn't a high- tech materials simple wing save a lot of weight?.Is there an engineering reason( other than cost) that makes it undoable?.
If they ever make a hikable HG i'll jump into the sport,meanwhile i'll float-collapse around the sky in my PG.I will probably take an HG course just to try it but i cant't see myself really getting into the sport.Who knows...
Just my two cents,don't nobody get offended eh!.
The day that you launch and the wind picks up and you can't make the LZ in your bag, is the day you'll wish you had a HangGlider, "my $ .02 worth
User avatar
By mattboy
#267945
Being a pilot, you know how rough and turbulent the air can be. Hiking up a mountain and flying off sounds like a great dream, but you don't know anything about the air around the area. You could be jumping into a huge sink, collapse your wing and die. And you know what people would call it? Pilot error.

Flying at safer and known locations where people know what areas are more safe to fly means you'll be at an established HG/PG site anyway, no hiking required.

I'll keep the rigid body and strong wires, crap happens and air can be really rough. There was a PG pilot that died at our local site here from a wing collapse going XC not too long ago. He was experienced and knew what he was doing. As convenient as PG is, I just don't trust the air to be smooth enough to keep me "safe."

That being said, I'd LOVE a quick short pack option for a hang glider. You could even ADD weight if you could give me an easy 6-7 ft. package as it's not the weight, but the length that makes it inconvenient. Yes storing my 18 ft. is a pain, but it's something I'm willing to sacrifice for a little extra insurance in the sky. I get where you are coming from though and I think MANY people are making the same decision as you for the same reasons.
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